TToB: Narcissistic traits are associated with a higher risk of heart failure. Tough or Bluff???
Added 2024-06-25 13:00:04 +0000 UTCComments
NPDs and BPDs have higher oxidative stress which is thought to contribute to their trait of being interpersonally hypersensitive; and oxidative stress is also associated with greater cardiovascular risk. Look up the study “ narcissistic, and borderline personality disorders: relationship with oxidative stress” by Lee
Chad
2025-09-28 23:37:01 +0000 UTCImo those traits are more likely to CAUSE heart failure (in other people)
StraightSlayer making the world gayer
2024-06-27 21:06:07 +0000 UTCHi Dr Kirk! Been watching and listening for a while, but I am a new patron so I don’t quite know the ins and outs of everything. How does one recommend a show for reactions? I’m so curious about your thoughts on Sherri Pappini! 🙏🏻🫶🥰
Taylor
2024-06-25 21:21:58 +0000 UTCI greatly appreciate your scientific rigor!
Psychology In Seattle
2024-06-25 20:26:00 +0000 UTCIt’s BLUFF! Narcissistic traits are associated with a LOWER risk of heart failure. It’s hard to know why, but researchers speculate that people with narcissistic personality traits are more likely to be vain and thus more likely to watch their weight and body image, which is associated with improved fitness and health. (DOI: 10.1016/j.jrp.2024.104465)
Psychology In Seattle
2024-06-25 20:25:34 +0000 UTCSuppressing your emotional needs in so many levels might cause it. Actual stress, anxiety level is super high.
Liis
2024-06-25 19:03:26 +0000 UTCSame!!
Suzanne
2024-06-25 15:50:59 +0000 UTCFrom an epidemiological perspective - there is some growing evidence of severe mental health conditions being associated with a higher risk of cardiovascular events, and also poorer outcomes following a surgery (e.g. coronary artery bypass graft). I have not looked at the literature but... Assuming 'narcissistic traits' were associated with trauma/ trauma reactivity, and assuming this meant an ongoing stress reaction/chronic stress response in the body, which meant elevated physical stress markers, then there very well could also be biological plausibility for narcissistic traits being associated with a higher risk of cardiovascular events and poorer outcomes. For example, I know there are studies suggesting childhood trauma being associated with poorer overall health outcomes and greatly shortened life expectancy. And from what I know, NPD often is stemming from early childhood trauma, so there is an association there. But this makes me think... that the trauma that leads to NPD is the underlying cause, not NPD. But for this particular question, it would be important to consider a few things. E.g. in this situation, how would we define 'narcissistic traits'? Would this only include those higher up in the spectrum? What would be the measurement/diagnostic tool, how would we control different biases in the diagnosis as well as the measurement of other risk factors we would want to account for? How would we select the participants for the study, who would we compare the cases to, e.g. what would the control group be? Individuals with some other mental health condition? How would we address selection bias here, which could severely distort the final results? How would we adjust for any confounding factors such as lifestyle, nutrition, various social determinants of health including access to healthcare, as well as the interplay between different (esp. mental health) comorbidities etc. Often studies stating these sort of associations do not adequately adjust for the biases, which means we cannot really know what the relationship between the exposure (narcissistic traits) and the outcome (heart failure) really is. But the scientist in me thinks: First, stress is a risk factor for adverse health outcomes including cardiovascular events, although causality is sometimes tough to establish because stress is often the underlying factor behind the usual, known risk factors, and its effect is thus often masked. Some longitudinal cohort studies following up people for decades are actually increasing our understanding on stress being a risk factor for a number of poor health outcomes, including heart attacks. Second, I assume that trauma reactivity is part of a chronic state of alertness and stress that are body's way of dealing with the past traumatic exposures. Based on this assumption, trauma = ongoing stress response in the body. Third, if assumed 'narcissistic traits' were also associated with such response in the body, then in conclusion yes, it would make sense that this could lead to 'narcissistic traits' being associated with a higher risk of cardiovascular events. But would it be the NPD or would it be the underlying trauma? (NPD being on the causal pathway) Also, multiple protective factors such as active lifestyle or healthy nutrition could shield a lot of the individuals with e.g. NPD diagnosis from such a health outcome, but measuring these factors is also often challenging/expensive. But the epidemiological risk can often be mitigated. Thus, individual's risk of a certain outcome really is a balancing act between different risks. So while someone suffering from e.g. NPD might have a slightly elevated risk of a heart attack, they might otherwise have a healthy lifestyle (exercise, being healthy weight, eating a well balanced diet with a low intake of ultra-processed foods), good access to healthcare, which again could reduce their risk. They also might be in therapy and assuming this helped them to manage those narcissistic traits in their day-to-day life so that they can have relatively healthy, loving relationships, and thus live a fulfilled life, which could also reduce the risk despite having received e.g. NPD diagnosis and still having some residual trauma reactivity. Yet, measuring all of these kinds of factors (and measuring them well) in a study that could answer the question somewhat convincingly... fascinating. And tough. So I think it is a tough one! 🙂
Marha
2024-06-25 15:00:36 +0000 UTCNarcissists are prone to rage, and rage is associated with heart disease, so it would make sense
Hollie Mo
2024-06-25 14:11:58 +0000 UTCI was recently fooled when the TToB was asking if people with narcissistic traits were more prone to depression. It was a bluff, so now I'm going to assume they're also less prone to heart attacks.
Thea Dahlberg
2024-06-25 13:33:59 +0000 UTCNot sure if it is true. But feels like a bluff. I think my grandparents on both sides had narcissistic traits, as well as my parents. Both my grand dads had heart attacks and both my grandmas had long drawn out illnesses that kept them bedridden for years. My dad to passed away the long-winded, bedridden way. And my great grandma as well. So from anecdotal experience, "Bluff".
Arnica Clearfield
2024-06-25 13:18:29 +0000 UTC
