Japanese Phonetics Episode 23โLIVE!
Added 2017-07-22 16:10:04 +0000 UTCBibliography
Japanese Phonetics Index Page
Good evening Patrons! The twenty-third episode of Japanese Phonetics is live! In this episode I wrap up the pitch-accent patterns for verbs and offer some general advice for approaching verb pitch-accent studies. Apologies for the lack of background ornaments and slightly unusual lightingโI just moved into my new place and haven't had time to unpack everything just yet. The old set-up should be restored in the next two to three days. Tour soon!
If you have any questions or concerns with regards to today's lesson leave a comment below. Thank you very much for your continued support, and good luck with your Japanese studies!
Best from Beppu,
Dลgen
Comments
Hi Ossian. The most bang for the buck you can get is to memorize the ใ form of verbs, because of how other conjugations build on it (ใใใ, etc.). If you have time and like to memorize more rules, or are the type to learn from repeated watching, going through the verb videos (including this lesson, 23) can be good. You can also watch native content and focus on how verbs are said. Hope this helps!
Dogen
2021-08-19 01:46:16 +0000 UTCHey Dogen or JP, I've watched through the entire pitch accent section on verbs twice now and I'm starting to get the hang of the basic rules and some conjugated forms. In this lesson I think you pretty clearly laid out what to rules you should try to memorize first and foremost when it comes to verbs to get the most value out of your time. In regards to this, do you have any recommended tips for memorizing specific rules other than watching these videos on repeat and shadowing along with the examples? Thanks in advance!
Ossian Bodin
2021-08-09 19:04:24 +0000 UTCYep!
Dogen
2020-05-27 05:57:33 +0000 UTCAll good! I had a hunch too because it had the ใฃ but just thought I'd ask, thanks for the reply!
Adam ใขใใ
2020-05-27 05:07:42 +0000 UTCHi Adam, I can't give a definite answer because I can't recall ever seeing this form in any of the resources I use, but my gut feeling tells me this follows the same basic pitch contour as the normal 'past form', as in yaCCHA DAME and naGUccha daME. Hope this helps, but please remember that this is just what seems correct to me!
Dogen
2020-05-27 04:32:23 +0000 UTCHey Dogen was wondering if you had any information on what the ใฃใกใ conjugations pitch accent pattern is for each of the respective verb pitch accent groups ใฃใกใ used in the sense of ๆฎดใฃใกใใใก
Adam ใขใใ
2020-05-27 00:56:35 +0000 UTCHi Joanna! I had never compared the two back to back, but that seems to be the case according to the NHK accent dictionary, and this certainly feels correct to me as well. Glad to hear you're making a lot of progressโkeep it up!
Dogen
2020-02-09 13:36:40 +0000 UTCHi Dogen, I was wondering if the pitch accent for the conditional ใใ form, such as ใ้ ใ้ฃฒใใ ใใ้่ปขใใฆใฏใใใพใใ, is the same pitch accent as the ใใ form for each respective verb type? I hope my question makes sense. Your series has helped me so much in being able to hear pitch accents properly, and I know I've been saying the conditional form wrong, so I wanted to double check the correct way! Thank you.
Joanna Tien
2020-02-09 07:58:11 +0000 UTCHi Jonathan! That's correct as far as I know, but I actually wasn't able to confirm this point as it's not clearly described in any of my resources. I do believe it is correct, though! Apologies for not being able to answer your question with conviction!
Dogen
2018-08-21 08:20:11 +0000 UTCHi Dogen, Apologies for asking another question. I hope you're not being overloaded! What is the pitch accent mapping with the suffix ้ใใ on atamadaka, heiban and nakadaka verbs and na and i adjectives? Playing around on OJAD seems to suggest that the down step in on the ใ for all of the above. Is this correct? Many thanks :)
Jonathan Malcolm
2018-08-20 09:10:47 +0000 UTCHi Kumamoto, Thanks for the support. Will answer ใใใปใใใปใกใใ etc. in a future advanced lesson. For now please see the concise response I gave to a previous question on honorifics below! ^^ For 1-2 mora words there are unfortunately no practical rules. For 3-4 mora words, most words that are atamadaka or heiban stay retain their accent patterns (the addition of an ใ/ใ does not change the accent for the word). this is true, for example, for both ๅๅผทใปใๅๅผท and ๅ ๆฐใปใๅ ๆฐ hope this helps!
Dogen
2017-08-02 11:36:55 +0000 UTCNot a problem. Good luck with your studies! Hope you do well on the test! ^^
Dogen
2017-08-02 11:33:18 +0000 UTCHi Dogen, I'm in love with this series and your Youtube videos as well! I have two questions: 1 - Do you have any pointers on how to handle the ใใปใ prefix? From what I've been able to hear seems like ๅนณๆฟ stays ๅนณๆฟ and in other words the downstep moves forward to stay in the same place? Is this right? 2 - What about the ใใใปใใใปetc suffixes? Do they just attach like particles? All the easy examples I can come up with are ไธญ้ซ words like ใ็ถใใ but I feel like I've heard ๅนณๆฟ names before and finding definite pitch accent on names is tricky :p Hope the move is going/has gone well; take your time answering and keep making great content!
foxinthewheat
2017-08-01 04:59:56 +0000 UTCThanks for the explanation for this particular case. I look forward to the lesson regarding this. Thanks again Dogen! I'm Looking forward to trying out the test your putting out soon too.
Thom
2017-07-30 06:33:05 +0000 UTCHi Thom, ใใ is one of the exceptions as it's an irregular verb, so I plan on doing an advanced lesson on this in the future, but my short answer for now would be to always say ๅๅผท as a ๅนณๆฟ noun, and to attach ใใ to that and conjugated it as a normal ๅนณๆฟ noun, with the caveat that the first mora will start high, rather than low, such that there is no downstep between ๅๅผท and ใใ or it's conjugations.
Dogen
2017-07-28 00:27:01 +0000 UTCHey, sorry for the influx of questions Dogen! honestly dont rush to answer this, I know you've just moved house and you must be busy as hell. I was wondering how to deal with ใใ verbs. You mentioned that ใใ itself is ๅนณๆฟ, but does this change when you add a ใใ noun to it. Like "ๅๅผทใใ". Come to think of it, perhaps most ใใ nouns are 4 mora 2 kanji and therefore are ๅนณๆฟ (like ๅๅผท), and does that mean when they are attached to the ใใ they stay as ๅนณๆฟ๏ผ
Thom
2017-07-27 14:45:00 +0000 UTCDominik, It is indeedโit may even be the primary factor. I believe that the consecutive vowels are having some influence here, however, as traditional phonetic rules for compounds suggest that a combination of ้ใ and ๅ ฅใ would result in a ๅนณๆฟ verb, rather than an ้ ญ้ซ one. Then again the shift from ๅนณๆฟ to ้ ญ้ซ could be a result of the unique way that these two combine compared to other compounds. Will be sure to let you know if I find any additional information on this topic!
Dogen
2017-07-25 13:08:50 +0000 UTCHi Edwin, I plan on covering this in the future during the 'pronunciation' half of the series. Incidentally it's very similar to the 'dd' in ladder, as odd as that might sound. This sound is pretty well documented online, so I would encourage you to check some other sources in the meantime :) Thanks for the support, and let me know if you have any other questions!
Dogen
2017-07-25 13:03:22 +0000 UTCDogen, I am having trouble pronouncing R in Japanese. Could you do a tutorial on how to pronounce it? Love your videos. Keep it up the good work!
Edwin
2017-07-25 01:25:23 +0000 UTCHi Dogen, isn'ยดยดยดt the discrepancy between the accents of ใฏใใ and ๅ ฅใใ also related to the fact that ใฏใใ itself is a compound of ้ใ and ๅ ฅใ๏ผใใ๏ผ, the latter of which is the true etymological partner of ๅ ฅใใ๏ผ
Dominik
2017-07-22 18:08:48 +0000 UTC
