Narcissism in the MCU

I really like Lindsay Ellis. I know that she gets a lot of harassment so I don’t want to pile on. That said, I’m extremely unhappy that this was the video she chose to make. I know this is a common trend in video essays but Aa a non-clinician she shouldn’t be using the language of clinicians. She can’t diagnose NPD from the DSM anymore than I can diagnose cancer from WedMD. I’m not saying she’s wrong about NPD. To do that I would have to have an understanding of personality disorders, (which I don’t) but without the proper training and given how much misinformation there is online, she’s way more likely to be wrong than right on this topic. Even if Loki isn’t a real person, NPD is a real condition that affects real people so why risk it?

Hanna Shultis

This was amazing, how you explained how a healthy person vs a narcissist sees their own child, awesome take

Viera Galikova

This was great, tagging Ego as the only real narcissist surprised me but yeah, totally.

The Overthinker

Damn, that would habe been really good!

Liz Jackson

That was really good!! It's telling that I hadn't really thought about NPD as a mental illness until watching this video :/

Vladimir Barash

This really touched close to home. Thanks for making it more easily explained

Tamashi Toh

This is really excellent!

Gabe

Love your work and insight! Thanks for all your and angela's efforts on these essays!

NativeRunner

I would love to hear the rest of your Crazy Ex-Girlfriend video essay, Lindsay. 👀

Nova

Interesting point about WandaVision not having any therapy in it. On first watch I honestly thought Agatha was going to turn out to be a therapist and Wanda was interpreting her as an evil bad no good witch because she's literally resisting therapy. They could have even kept the magic punchout just have it be a metaphor becoming too real in the nexus or something

Natalie Arnold

Two essays in two days? Much happiness. What I really like about these Lindsay is that you make your points using movies with a broader appeal, so there's no argument about this being a discussion limited only to 'high art' - and that challenges many of my snobbish preconceptions. You also handled the technical aspects of the DSM in a way that is rarely done properly, and defined your terms very clearly. I really enjoy these long form essays that are actually essays and not summaries of the text. Cheers, Shaun.

So true. I remember several Glee episodes were based on the premise of "competing to win the right to be called the biggest diva of the small-town show choir" as if that's a good thing to want.

Rich Kee

I’m surprised not one Ryan Murphy character popped up in this video. That guy frames so many narcissistic characters as “people who just know what they want and will do whatever it takes” that it really is rather telling of his own personality.

Most of the people who I suspect are narcissists in my daily life are pretty miserable. Mostly because they keep alienating the people they desperately need love from, and are left alone again and again. And they lack the tools to understand why. And the nature of their issue prevents them from getting help, or from being able to accept what their friends/therapists/whoever are telling them. But I've also been hurt by the npds in my life, and so have a lot of my friends. Usually their family members or romantic partners. So. It's a conundrum.

run_away

Lindsey, thanks for this very helpful and meaningful, at least for me, look into an important part of our individual behavioral and collective cultural psychology. In addition, thanks so much for writing, polishing, publishing, and releasing Axiom’s End. I love the audio book and the printed hardcover, I have them both and love them for many reasons! I also preordered Truth Of The Divine a few months ago and really appreciate you, your staff, and all that you do. I also love Musical Splaining and I really appreciate you, Kaveh, your guests, and all the fun that you each help make possible!

Thheilieohwauh

As a geeky trauma therapist, I am SO STOKED for Truth of the Divine.

Lydia Thornton

(I'm sorry, I'm trying to be funny, was I mean instead? Sorry if so, definitely not my intent)

Rozenn Keribin

Well actually it's spelled "psychopathy", not "psycopathy"

Rozenn Keribin

Maybe, I'm speaking out of ignorance, but I honestly don't believe they do. The main reason why I lost all interest in anything produced by Disney is because nearly everything they put out (at least, that isn't a terrible live-action adaptation of their greatest successes) is so incredibly homogeneous. Heck, even Disney's Star Wars feels like a Star Wars Prequels skin wrapped over the top of a MCU film. Basically, the only film (of the ones I've seen) that I didn't end up retroactively disliking was Black Panther. And that was solely because it's a story about a place and not a person and the protagonist isn't a snarky douche that spends the entire time snarking.

Egor A. Palchyk

Genuinely can't say how much I appreciate that there's someone out there singing the praises of GG2. :D

BestStressed

I was thinking that too. But also it was nice not to hear his stupid voice saying words, so I was kind of grateful for it.

run_away

The only thing i need to know is where can i buy the Guy Fieri candle.

MissFluffy

Thing is, yes, Disney is an evil mega-corporation that does not just invest it in characters people know and love that they can string along in a continuous(ish) narrative and milk for merchandising till the heat-death of the universe, but also puts their arcs in the hands of a broad range of people from a broad range of backgrounds, who can tell relatable stories about real-world issues in the most fantastical ways, because the first part would net them a sizable return, but combined with the second, gives them license to print their own money. BUT, while their goals may be shallow and self-serving, a) it nevertheless gives us some great stories about real-world issues, told in fantastical ways, and b) it's somewhat heartening that while "Make big thing make other big thing blow up so crowd goes 'Oooh!'" will generally net you enough cash that your kids, spouse, mistress(es) and army of staff that maintain your Malibu mansion won't be worrying about a cold Christmas, if you really want to make bank, you have to make people CARE.

MABrock1980

Kirk Fucking Douglas!!! https://youtu.be/FAc9b-URAbY?t=84

I don’t seem to be able to watch this. Am I doing something wrong?

Lindsay, don't downplay your own work -- your videos gave me a lot of language to recognize other issues I've had in the last year, alone (you, and a few other YouTubers) and I wouldn't have it any other way.

phastinemoon

I feel like Loki would be the ultimate fantasy of them all to have a toxicly narcissistic person actually face their own faults and admit they hurt people

Amanda Whitney

it is an amazing tool for never having to grow. any time you take a complaint to those people they change to self loathing and you find yourself comforting them for the pain they cause you.

Who doesn't love an Anus Remix!

Christina Rodriguez

"Obsessive self-loathing is just another form of narcissism" - this is such a true and important point and once you know this, the world and the people around you make way more sense. The people I've suspected of having it were far more likely to obsess over all the ways they suck than put forth a cartoonish veneer of Disney-villain confidence.

Jason Pargin

I literally just opened this after writing a letter to someone causing me a lot of this harm. I cannot tell you how helpful this was to me. thank you.

I just rewatched your take on Guardians OTG Vol. 2 and I am SO HERE FOR THIS. But haven't watched Loki yet...so I guess I ought to.

Kait Hatch

Love this one! Can't wait until it's up on Youtube; my sister's dad is a malignant narcissist, and I'm eager to show this to her.

Tara Leederman

Loved this (as always!). I'm actually a psychiatrist and really appreciated all the research you did, everything was dead on.

Marian

Kirk Douglas! No mom will ever forgive you.

Callen

(anus)

Chuck Sebian-Lander

the best summaries/critiques of D+ Loki and its finale I've heard to date are "you can't narrative arc your way out of NPD" and also "while the rando in the background chews the scenery". this video rules

Chuck Sebian-Lander

Loved this video a lot. Not gonna waste your comment space detailing my circumstance beyond "recently learned a lot through experience with my self-endangering pleasing tendencies", but it was a neat moment in time to get a very strong essay on this topic. I wouldn't be personally overjoyed by the thematic rug sweep laid out for the Loki TV series, at least right now, but recognize that flawed execution not some ominous harm. So I am glad to see a very coherent buildup to the point that every little bit helps in normalizing the idea that people are people & illnesses are treatable, especially on the social language beast that is "narcissism" and "A Narcissist". It's a good point that needs more stating.

Elaine Åhlfeldt

I really, really love this one. I'm currently training to become a therapist, and we recently had a seminar on personality disorders, with a special focus on borderline pd and narcissistic pd. While there are pretty specific treatments for bpd (dialectic behavioural therapy and tranference focused psychotherapy), there is still nothing specific for npd. And as you correctly said in the video, people with npd rarely seek treatment, and if they do, it'd usually for something else, like depression. The most poignant thing one of my teachers said about npd is "Don't make yourself so big, you're not that small". While people with npd sometimes inflict great suffering on their surroundings, they badly suffer themselves too, especially if they do not get the validation they need from the outside. While a healthy person is able to create their own self-worth, people with npd are not, and that is a terrible burden and source of great pain. And while this doesn't help the people being hurt by them, like their children, it definitely helps to keep this in mind when we try to reduce the demonisation of npd, and especially when trying to help them therapeutically.

Liz Jackson

Also! In the series, when "Our" Loki and Sylvie first met, he proposed overthrowing the Time Keepers to rule the TVA together. While he grew and changed in that time, she didn't; her goal of finding whoever runs the TVA and killing them for erasing her timeline remained strong. The way I saw it, at the end of the series she couldn't believe his goal had changed because her goal hadn't.

Glad you liked Loki even if it didn't stick the landing for you. I liked the ending b/c Sylvie mentions she "set up flares" everywhere she went until she learned to hide in Apocalypses, and nearly every other Loki Variant we encounter in the series are power-hungry liars and backstabbers. I got the impression that Sylvie has encountered too many other Loki Variants on her run from the TVA to trust this one. It's less how HE has behaved to make her distrust him, and more "she can't overcome the trauma and betrayals of her past, and he can't escape the reputation and role he's been given by the TVA."

I think that could maybe be a flub? lol. I just caught that myself.

#JusticeForGamora

Naomi

frankly I'm just amazed you were able to make a whole video about narcissism without once mentioning the most well known IRL one, our good old former president

Lukael

I'd love it if that clip was extended and released by itself

Danny

Work of anus.

Brian Haberer

aaaaaand then in the foreground

Oh hey there, 'Truth of the Divine' in the background!

Nice. Enjoyed every second of it.

Good lord, the Phil Collins got me. Repeatedly.

Will always listen to you talk about GotG2. There is a typo in the "less stigmatized, not Not stigmatized" - an extraneous "4".

Alina

Not sure if this is worth editing at this point, but you can see the edge of the cursor on the right side of the screen during the Office UK clip at the 9:50ish mark

Tyler Jennes

The credits are an absolute work of art.

FauxRetro

2 videos in one day feels like Christmas!

Suse Zink Diesel

it'll make sense when you see the public version (which is not ad-free)

Lindsay Ellis

Great essay!! But man you teased us with hinting at how much you hate infinity war.. I’d love to see a deeper dive into that

Kevin Herviou

Is calling Kurt Russel "Kirk Douglas" a joke I didn't get? :)

JAMES CAMPBELL

You need to send this to Taika Waititi and tell him to wait for the credits 🤣

Heather Freyschild

Different videos on Patreon and Nebula on the same day?

James D

Excellent video, and I particularly like the way you talk about the more comedic media.

1: Great video! 2: If loki burns with glorious anus so much, he probably should get that looked at. 3: Brief visual thing which might be worth a re-render to fix (the horror), but ~3:59, we can see the Hulu HUD on the transition to talking about Arrested Development.

Orellien

should i use the link from the previous post to preorder or is there a new one?

didn’t want this video to end, so good

Greatly enjoyed this entry of yours and anticipate to see your next video.

Jebest4781

Through the what now?

Frog Loki 🐸

Poorly Fleshed Skeleton