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N_taii
N_taii

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Proof of Life #262: Big upcoming changes for HC3 (wall of text, but please read if you can)(Public)

Heya guys and gals, how are you doing in this fine morning/evening/afternoon? I’m here to drop the latest proper PoL since the last update released. There’s quite a lot to unpack, so let’s get to it.

About Update 19’s development

First of all, I didn’t get to work much on the new Lily-focused update last week. I mean, I did a little bit, as I’ve got most of it planned out, and am now developing the first scene, but a lot got in the way. I know I said I wanted to reduce the time between update by making shorter ones, but fate had other plans it would seem.

Big(?) changes coming after Update 19 (at least for me)

So, first of all, some might already be aware that I struggled right before the end of the release of Update 18 because of one major issue: RPGMaker MV (the engine I’m working on) can only handle 999 maps per project, and I got to that point. I found a work around by deleting a few maps meant only for testing, but that was just a temporary solution while I worked on a long-term fix.

Turns out, there isn’t one. At least not one which would work with the amount of map customization my game has. I would know, I spent several days last week scouring forums and looking for one. That’s why I came up with one relatively drastic solution: start a second project that would be titled HC3: part two.

(You can see in the screenshot what a “project” is, with all the maps and everything on the bottom left. I would start another one and keep a bunch of maps and deleting the rest, but more on that below)

What does it entail for you, the player? Well, not much. You’ll just have to click on the .exe to launch part 2 like you did for every update until now. Part.2 will assume you finished all the content in part.1 (main quests, side quests, Triple Trident opponents), and starting a new game would take you right at the beginning of the new content. For example, update 18 ended as Main Quest 26 ended. That means clicking "New Game" on part.2 would have you start in the city at the very beginning of Main Quest 29 (the next one after 26). Not that much different from what most people do anyway. Same for the side-quests. Part.1 (the current one) will contain Lily’s 7th quest (currently in development), but Haylen’s 7th quest will probably start in part.2.

However, you wont be able to load earlier saves since, well, the content in part.1 won’t be in part.2. That’s so I can delete a bunch of maps that were used in part.1 without breaking the game and work towards the 999 maps limit once again. As such, it is highly recommended you finish all the content you’re interested in part.1 before starting part.2, otherwise it’ll just assume you’ve finished it anyway and skip over it.

What will be in part.1: the main storyline until MQ26, Lily’s storyline until her 7th quest (included), probably Haylen’s storyline until her 6th quest (also included).

What will be in part.2: the rest of the game until the endings. You will be able to rewatch all the scenes in the reminiscence room (all pre-unlocked), all the freeroam + mini-stories that were visible at the end of the last update of part.1 (which will probably be Update 19).

What are the drawbacks from this?

For you? Not that many. For example, if you want to start Lily or Haylen’s storylines later on, you can just open up part.1, load your latest save and do them, then start part.2 once you’ve done all their contents for part.1. It’s a bit more of a hassle, but merely means a few extra clicks.

Same for the Triple Trident: part.2 will simply assume you’ve beaten every opponent so far, but if you haven’t just load part.1 and do it, then start part.2.

As said above, you’ll still be able to rewatch every scene from part.1 in the reminiscence room of part.2, so that’s not an issue.

However, the saves from part.1 won’t be usable in part.2. you’ll still be able to load some of them, but it’ll just get you stuck, so no use trying. Not much of an issue though, because why would you want to use the saves from part.1 in part.2?

Now, there’s one “major” issue: the dialogue choices you’ve taken so far, how do they get tracked from part.1 to part.2? Unfortunately, after spending another part of last week scrambling for a solution, I only found one that didn’t involve you having to look for weird files in weird places to transfer to part.2. It’s pretty underwhelming, but here goes:

At the end of MQ26 (the beach storyline), an orb will pop up in the reminiscence room. Interacting with it will bring up all the story choices you’ve made so far (how many NTR ending-related ones, Happy ending, Revenge ending), and you will then be prompted to enter those values again at the start of part.2 so you can start with the same numbers you had at the end of part.1.

I know, it’s pretty immersion-breaking, and I’m sorry about it. If I could find a better solution, I definitely would.

What changes for me (if you’re interested)?

Well, a bit more work with disclaimers and such, but that’s the easy part.

In part.2, to bring the total of maps down, I will have to delete a lot of them. That means every single one of them save for the main map/main map-related one, the reminiscence room, and the ones needed to view the scenes in the reminiscence room.

I will also have to skim through a lot of stuff to make sure nothing’s broken and things on the remaining maps of part.2 are working the same as they did at the end of part.1.

I think it should take about 2-3 days of full work, so not that long.

On a positive note, it should make development easier for me, as it was getting more and more complicated to work on it due to the sheer amount of bloat due to the project’s huge size.

When will part.2 happen?

At least not for another update or so. The current update won’t see any changes since I’ve still got a bunch of maps to work with, and Lily’s new quest won’t need many new ones. Maybe for Update 20(Haylen’s 7th quest), depending on its contents and the amount of maps I’ve still got left before I run out.

About the Steam version

Slight change of topic just to tell you that the Store page should be released very soon, I’m just working on a demo version (until the end of MQ9 and everything before) to release along it.

However, the game won’t be up for sale until the end of June of this year, even if the store page is up a lot earlier. The reason is that a game’s successful launch is highly dependent on the amount of wishlists before it releases, so I need to let it gather wishlists first for a few months before I put the game up for sale. That’s the advice I received from a lot of other devs who went the Steam route before me. Sorry I wasn’t more clear about it before.

To conclude

Sorry for the wall of text, but the situation called for it, and I want everyone to be up to date with the future of this game. Don’t hesitate to ask me should you have any questions!

Thank you for reading, and have a wonderful week!

N_Taii

Proof of Life #262: Big upcoming changes for HC3 (wall of text, but please read if you can)(Public)

Comments

Hmmm, I'll have to see if I can make it work, but there's quite a lot of different possible combinations, so I can't promise anything

N_taii

I'm sure you probably already thought of something like this, but I was wondering if it really wasn't possible to have a system where based on the choices the player made the game would generate a password that you'd just need to enter into the second part? It would be a more elegant solution, if possible.

Knoloa

Yeah, I believe it's the best I could do under the current circumstances. I've played the first Dragon Age as well as Inquisition, but I don't remember porting the choices like that. Oh well, let's just say I stole their ideas (that they probably took from somewhere else as well)^^

N_taii

Unfortunate that you couldn't find a work around, but seems you've already thought of a pretty decent solution. As for the orb rehashing you choices? It reminds me a bit of porting in your choices from the old Dragon Age games in Inquisition.

Blue Fishcake

Yeah, porting plugins would always be the bottleneck, and no one knows your situation better than you. Well, I think you found an acceptable solution regardless! Good luck!

Jay

999 sounds like a pretty low limit for an RPG type of project. The positive i can see is at least part 1 ends with a complete quest and not in the middle of one.

Alibaba

Good! Honestly I didn't remember RPG Maker MZ, I understand that little by little several developers were moving to that software.

SFukuro

Yeah, all things considered, I'm pretty lucky. It would have been a shame to start part 2 in the middle of the beach update. I guess the devs for the RPGMaker Engine never expected anyone to do a project with a size like mine (although HC3 does have a lot of duplicates for the maps to make every day development easier).

N_taii

Nope. In part.2, all the scenes of part.1 will be automatically unlocked, but it'll all be there as it was in part.1.

N_taii

Indeed, I'll be switching to MZ. I didn't want to do it earlier because of the limited customization options due to the engine being pretty young (back in 2022). Now, it should be fine.

N_taii

Actually, the map limit now stands at 2000 for MZ, but enough for what I want to do. Porting the game would be an herculean task, because you have to keep in mind I have to find an MZ equivalent for each MV plugin I have and make all the changes necessary. This would just invite bugs upon bugs. I'd rather go with the part.2 solution. Easier, and far less of a headache.

N_taii

Will this affect the recollection room in anyway?

NotSoAwesme .

The life of a dev, even if you plan ahead you are going to stumble into issues; but from the sounds of things you've dealt with it well. The beach update is a nice point to leave Part 1 on (main story-wise) and the decisions using the orb might be immersion-breaking but it will take a few seconds and the rest will play as normal so everything is grand. I have to say though a 999 map limit for an RPG engine seems a bit low; I understand there needs to be limitations but come on.

TSP

I'd imagine Mz would work in the future

Jay

A very long PoL but necessary to explain the current situation of the game. Because of that map problem for HC4 and future games are you going to switch to another software or will you stay with RPG Maker MV?

SFukuro

Thanks! That's a question I get a lot and to which I don't have a definitive answer. Maybe 5-6 more before we reach the endings? As for the endings themselves, it'll take one update per ending, so 4 in total (if we count both paths for the NTR, either town bicycle or exclusivity with each antagonist for the women) PS: With HC2 I made the mistake of trying to keep the "one month" rule per update during the endings, which meant underwhelming content for some of them due to a lack of time. There won't be any time limitations this time. It'll take however long I believe it needs for the endings to feel satisfying.

N_taii

You probably know this, but RPGM MZ got rid of the map limit, and there are decent ways to port stuff from MV to MZ. Would probably also take a few days of work, but might be worth it in the long haul. I imagine making maps using map slot 999 and then modifying the data via editing MapInfos.json and copying the maps json over after editing their ID would be too much effort as well (this would allow > 999 maps while still using the 999th map as a dev map to make the other maps in within the env)

Jay

Hey at what percentage of story we are before reaching the end? And how many update do you plan to do? Love the game so far

JAN

Yeah. From what I've learned, the 999 maps limit in MV isn't due to anything but the developers deciding it should be 999 for God knows what reason. I'm pretty pissed about that^^ Next game will definitely be in RPGMaker MZ though (the newer version, for those that don't know), as it allows for up to 2000 maps, so far enough for a project like mine.

N_taii

I absolutely hate rpgmv and regret not starting my project on Mz, though I’m sure it has its own pitfalls aswell. Wait till you learn about how 4K images render in potato resolution on mv due to its compressing and decompressing the image rather than using it as it is. ( no fix for this either)

allahim


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