August 17 Update
Added 2024-08-17 17:00:07 +0000 UTCBig TLS news to talk about today, but first some quick business. Posting this update a day early both to gather info and to hopefully kickstart my work. This week I posted another art preview, in this case Shard Sipping. This was the biggest and most complex scene we've done, in terms of art!
Now, it's time to talk about the combat system in TLS. The next update will have a bunch of additions and improvements, as previously discussed, but along with that I'm considering a major visual update. I hope to get the opinions of players on this, so read the whole post if you're interested!
Here is Yarra doing an attack in the default battle system:
Again thanks to Rachnera, we have the option of displaying the character busts during combat. This has a major advantage of being ready to go immediately, since the system already works. We'd be limited in how much variation we can have, but we could put up different expressions:
But the code for this allows us to display any image we configure, which leads to an obvious possibility... new art. If we were willing to go to the effort and expense, combat could look more like the video above, or like this:
These are not mock-ups (they were created in the engine) but they're also not final. Details like the height of the characters could of course change, like Yarra being over the damage number there. The point of this is to show what's possible in principle.
Beyond just being visually dynamic, we could have actions that show more character personality, such as Yarra using an item here:
Of course, half of you refuse to use items, but I still think it's a nice touch if the characters all have their own unique way of doing things, even common actions.
The opposite side of the scale is that this method would be very expensive and eat up a ton of Annikath's art time. I consider it, however, because players would see these drawings far more than they'd see any given sex scene, so the effect on the game would be outsized compared to other art.
I'm honestly at a crossroads here, and this would be a major business decision on my end. What I'm looking for from players is how you feel about this and how much it would matter to you, as a TLS experiencer. If people want too much, combinatorial explosion would make this unfeasible: we can't have different images for all weapon types a character can use, different outfits during special sections, battle damage variants, and so on (we'd cover major changes like Aka's transformation, though). This would already be a massive undertaking as seen above.
Regardless of the final decision, players would be able to turn it off in the options menu if they prefer, just like animations. So in essence we're deciding between the busts option (good to go) and the art option (a lot more work), or a hybrid such as more edits to the primary busts.
Sometimes I make these into polls so non-commenters can chime in, but I think this one is too complex given potential variations, so sound off if you have an opinion!
Comments
The dynamic option sounds like a great idea and a very cool way to inject some personality in the combat system
earthwormjim3
2024-10-27 08:29:41 +0000 UTCHaving the theory alone is enough for me to fantasize away ^^
guillaume nguyen
2024-10-04 22:06:20 +0000 UTCWhat I believe you were proposing is having all the character art on screen at all times? While this is possible in theory, it would require different art assets and be a very different sort of battle screen. The goal is to represent their actions, and yes, those will be in the lower left as they act.
Sierra Lee
2024-10-04 21:49:35 +0000 UTCSo for now, and potentially forever, there is no way to spread the busts of all party members towards the right ? It's always on the left ?
guillaume nguyen
2024-10-04 21:25:05 +0000 UTCThese examples, including the video, are a little old. In the newest build of the battle busts, the interface is shifted right so there's no overlap.
Sierra Lee
2024-10-04 21:16:53 +0000 UTCUsing dynamic busts is a good idea, but they block the interface below. I have 2 potential ideas about that : - First, spread out the busts over the width of the screen and rework the interface to make their presence permanent instead of having them pop up over Simon. I don't even know if it's possible, but at least it will be sure to take a ton of work. - Second possibility, just temporarily remove the interface when the animations plays, and put it back after so that we can check our HP, mana and lust. Less work than the first option, but also less visually appealing. Whatever you choose, don't work on it now and meditate a lot.
guillaume nguyen
2024-10-04 16:24:48 +0000 UTCHello, welcome to the Patreon! One thing first: I have promised to never put TLS behind a paywall, so the final version will be as free as all the rest. That said, it will also be my biggest chance for the game to reach a large audience, so I'm taking it very seriously. Thank you for your input on the decisions going into this process!
Sierra Lee
2024-08-27 22:48:38 +0000 UTCI took the the time to read through most of the existing comments since I'm relatively new to the community (and the game!) and like to be able to offer a more contextual opinion. It seems to me that adding combat busts of any variety would add a lot of character to the game that would probably get more new players involved when you finally release that 1.0, especially if you're planning to monetize for any amount on the steam release. It also seems that there's a mechanical benefit to combat of being able to better determine weaknesses/resists since you get the additional visual cue of who is doing which attack. I think the art option would probably play to this game's strengths really well, namely that TLS constantly feels ~alive~ in a way that even triple a titles fail to. Combat is probably the most samey portion of the game over the hours of playtime, and I believe spending the time and money on having even a basic set of combat action based art would make it feel unique and really add to the charm and energy of the game!
John Brek
2024-08-27 19:05:07 +0000 UTCI'd love seeing these images added to the combat. It would make combat more lively, in a sense, because due to the limits of that RPG Maker version combat appears rather static. And for me, who sometimes looses track of who does what in combat, this would be just a little helper to stay on top of the action. I'd postpone implementing this to a 1.x version unless it doesn't take up a big chunk of your capacity.
Johnny Bragas
2024-08-21 20:36:49 +0000 UTCI do agree that the second option with showing more will be better in it over all. There have been quite a bit where I have turned off animation just because it is not very interesting or fun to look at. Though have suffered from that in not always being able to tell which spell or attack caused to hit the enemy weakness. Having the busts would change that. Although I would say that this should be something of more of an upgrade for when the game is done, or something that does not take away from that. More of a 1.01 update as is so close to the games end
Edward Culham
2024-08-20 05:28:15 +0000 UTCYeah, it's hard to say the actual effect, but this idea occurred to me too. I think at minimum it will add a little more motivation for players to try out new characters and techniques, which might lead to more experimentation.
Sierra Lee
2024-08-20 01:32:33 +0000 UTCHmmmm something I don't think anyone else has mentioned? We have a great selection of party members, but we often fall into a rut with using the same handful for every encounter. I feel that the unique animations for every character add not just charm and visual flair, but they would encourage me to "mix things up" more often. Especially if there are unique item-sprites for every character, I might use at least 15 items in a given play through :p Or deliberately rolling with a party of succubi just so all their saucy sprites will give the battle a different vibe. But seeing the unique poses added with dynamic busts, and how they differ for even simple things like items, should help endear players to the characters more. Such as seeing Qum's cute face beaming every time she heals or gets so endearingly excited to offer someone an item. Then have a more battle-hardened healer like Carina show more concern/resolve on her face instead of joy to help sell the unique vibe each SHOULD bring. Uyae can have an interesting contrast between the gentleness shown in her healing sprites Vs the ferocity of her attacks. I'd be much more likely to swap out characters and try out each and every new set of synergy skill if there was that extra bit of presentation backing them up. While the appeal won't be for everyone and can wear off for most, that basic impact can't be understated nor the effect of that extra bit of joy/discovery in the much more personable animations. Which is also why I'd recommend against the basic busts. It's too redundant and samey with the standard dialogue system. If busts are going to be added to combat, then they need to be DISTINCT to have proper impact. And if Annikath herself claims it won't take much effort, then a few unique spirtes per character will go a long way for the investment. This is definitely something to prioritize before the 1.0 if it's going to be added: it WILL help the game stand out against the flood of RPGM games. And any little extra bit of style and personality will go a long way into player retention Vs someone bouncing off in the first hour.
Duncan Lutz
2024-08-20 00:24:47 +0000 UTCIt's a good idea, but a pose for common actions and skill groups for each character is probably a ton of work already, so I'd vote for that and no more, if even that's feasible. Some might be usable in multiple places, you obviously don't need a different pose for basic attack and 'strong attack' or 'quick attack' skills. So, I'd like new art poses rather than busts, but erring on the side of having less of them than going crazy with the variants.
JD
2024-08-19 19:44:05 +0000 UTCI'd go with the variants over the basic busts easily. The question is how well can you get the characters' personalities and the energy of the attacks to pop out to the player. If that can be done well then it's probably worth the cost. Rachnera's preview video makes me optimistic about this.
NotEnoughSand
2024-08-19 18:27:46 +0000 UTCThen going all in would probably be the best option, the hybrid approach would stop it getting stale sure, but if you want a wow factor, having four or five different busts for every combat character would help immensly with that. Lilith is the biggest danger to your budget tho, Fart Of God's not getting its own art work would be a travesty, and when you're in for a penny it's difficult not to spend the full pound for each of her skills.
SerEaglenose
2024-08-19 16:48:08 +0000 UTCIn terms of attracting newcomers, something like this is a very good way of differentiating the game from standard RPGM fare. On the other hand, I don't think there's a single person who's been invested for a long time who'd prefer resources going to this over finishing what's left of the game, especially since it's so close.
eidolic
2024-08-19 14:44:54 +0000 UTCThe truth is that TLS is in a strange place where very little of the new effort I put in brings any new subscribers, but the effort I have put in over the past years does bring in some. I hope this would be "worth it" in the sense of rewarding those who have supported me, and hopefully getting the largest possible new audience when the game launches.
Sierra Lee
2024-08-19 12:40:18 +0000 UTCI think they add something significant to the combat, and would tie the character's personalities and combat mechanics together. I also agree that not every move needs a sprite, the 5 sprites for the yarra demo seem like they could cover pretty much all of her moves. My vote is for ~5 per character or less.
Simon
2024-08-19 11:24:13 +0000 UTCI'm certainly not entirely against the idea... But I'd say that the most important thing here, is not interrupting the flow and speed of the combat. There is a LOT of encounters in this game, and people like me who know the game in and out, tend to breeze through the game at breakneck pace, finishing most encounters in a matter of seconds. So the one thing I hope that these animations *won't* do is prolong combat animations. That's the one thing that would make the experience worse for me.
DankPotatoes
2024-08-19 08:05:09 +0000 UTCI imagine this is somewhat redundant, but as long as there is a toggle for them I think that bust animations are great. Partly I think its important to have the toggle for repetition and speed worries, but also that this game balances a number of tones. There is a lot of comedy and lightheartedness, and the art is very good at reflecting that, but for the most part combat is a stressful/scary place (relatively speaking), and I feel that the barrenness of combat helps add to that feeling, especially in the early stages of the game when you are a very tiny player in a very hostile and vile world. Of course, this is very much in the "they changed it and now it sucks" kind of complaining, which is not generally that helpful. But I think a toggle would go miles towards making that a non-issue. In a perfect world I'd ask for bust animations that reflect the changing attitudes, status, and perspective of characters, but that would be completely psychotic in terms of workload.
Nicholas
2024-08-19 05:58:33 +0000 UTCI know, right? It's a bummer because this is the game that got me into adult games, but boy does that become a rough comparison very fast.
Nicholas
2024-08-19 05:46:20 +0000 UTCThe idea and execution is great, and it would definitely improve the game over all, taking it further from yhe RPG Maker ghetto, and if you genuinely just want to make the best game possible it would definitely be worth the investment. But, at this stage of development would it really help your bottom line? Like the handful of extra subscribers it would bring in wouldn't cover the costs of the new assets, so it would be taken from your over all profits instead. But TLS is obviously a passion piece so if it being better is worth that in your eyes then of course go all in.
SerEaglenose
2024-08-19 05:26:49 +0000 UTCI've been playing through with my roomie, who has some reading difficulty, and she always disengages during combat because she can't tell what's going on. This would *definitely* help that. You probably don't even need a unique bust for every skill, either, so long as the hit-animations are different. You could probably use the same bust for IE: fire, ice, and lightning, so long as you use a different one for (fire, ice, lightning) *storm*.
Upthorn
2024-08-19 04:32:11 +0000 UTCTo keep it simple my vote would be 100% in support of any level of additional animation/images associated with characters attacks. It gives the characters a ton of personality especially if there are variations based on which attacks are used. Makes me feel like im playing a more professional game like a final fantasy/tales of.... game rather than your standard indie rpg. Speed made plenty of points about practicality and I entrust you with deciding how extensive this theoretical feature could or would be. Any level of this feature is a bonus in my book.
Sundeigh
2024-08-18 15:47:07 +0000 UTCI heard some people complaining the images remained on for too long and were hiding some information like damage numbers. And... They are perfectly right, I had put the cleanup code in the wrong spot. Here's the fixed version: https://youtu.be/j-wokmF5prE
Rachnera
2024-08-18 14:39:53 +0000 UTCI think this encapsulates basically all my opinions on the matter. Very good points.
AnythingAtAll
2024-08-18 14:32:36 +0000 UTCHow about a compromise? This addition has great potential and near-unlimited opportunity for feature creep. You could animate every action for every character in great detail and change based on equipment and context and whatever else... Ridiculously expensive. You could also add some minimal bust popups on a few of the actions for the important characters or events, which adds some flavor, improving the overall quality of the game, but not really being necessary. Both have merit, so it's a question of cost and priorities. No matter the complexity, I think people would get used to them and begin ignoring them after a while. So I don't think investing too much in the base moveset makes sense. Being very efficient with the moves that get spammed seems like the best way to go to me. However, there are particular moves that you unlock over time, after 100 hours of work. They're great rewards for your progress and accomplishments. If those were exceptional not just in their power level, but also in how they express the character's action in-game, that would be very impressive. A detailed animation on "ultimate" skills could be a good middle ground. Since the quantity of those is limited, more attention to detail can be justified, and since they come relatively late into the game, they not only refresh the player's enjoyment but there's also less time to desensitize to them. Big battles and special events or the few moves gods get to throw out could also merit the highly animated approach. I think it's worth doing, and if it costs some of the art from the sex scenes, that's fine. The scenes get carried by the text anyway. This would be a more impactful way of using that budget in my opinion. Starting off with unique moves in pivotal moments in the game as a proof of concept is probably best, and then just having it continue developing as the final inches of the game flesh out. It's something that would help take the game from 9.5/10 to 10/10 :)
Speed
2024-08-18 14:10:59 +0000 UTCSo, I really like the idea of combat busts in general and think it's a great way of showing characterization. However I am sympathetic to the people who are saying it may get repetitive, or that it may make repeat playthroughs cumbersome. I am wondering if it's possible to make these animations togglable; that way if you are bored of the animations you can just turn them off and quickly finish combat instead. I know in that situation, it feels like the busts are a waste, but I'd argue that as long as the player uses them even for a few hours, the amount of characterization they do more than outweighs what scenes you could try to do instead in the late game. I really do like the potential for the combat busts, and just letting you know who the characters are within a few battles..... and if you could perhaps introduce a couple of new busts as the game progresses, to show character development, I really think that might take things to the next level
steve
2024-08-18 13:59:47 +0000 UTCI'm in favor of a hybrid approach. I'm absolutely for the idea of combat busts since it not just adds some nice visuals, but is also a better way of knowing who's currently using what skill compared to needing to read some fast-moving text at the corner of the screen. I think it's also an opportunity to show some character during combat, either with Yarra being enthusiastic about the more overtly sexual skills she has, or with Yarra and Robin having some fun interactions in the busts during their synergy skill, which I'd already seen a glimpse of when Rachnera first showcased this in the server. On the flip side, the busts can get stale over the hundred or so hours an average player will go through each playthrough, more so for experienced players who may opt to turn off effects. I think the ideal balance is simple, easily recognizable art that concisely showcases the character and a bit of their personality when they're using a certain set of skills - for example, Nalili being more horny in her more sexual moves like Masturbate (duh) and Sexual Aegis, but looking all cold and badass for the more martial ones like Orgy of Blows. No matter what kind of visuals end up in the combat busts, they *will* fade into the background eventually. I'd hate for Annikath to make some incredibly detailed art that won't appear for nearly long enough for players to appreciate anyway. I can see others being very supportive of the idea in general, so consider this one more voice in the pile. Really, the only limiting factor is how much effort you and especially Annikath can afford to spend on a massive project like this. If you do go all in, I agree with Decarabia that it's better to finish everything before v1.0. That's when the most eyes will be on the game since its creation, and having all that art during combat - a significant chunk of the game - will do wonders in getting as much attention as it deserves. Also, like what Grim said, it'll help TLS stand out from other RPGM games since it does still very much look like a typical one. And I'm sure you know how much 'judge a book by its cover' applies to audiences for games lol. I hope this helps!
AnythingAtAll
2024-08-18 11:55:15 +0000 UTCThe dynamic busts look great, I'm in favour of that.
Spaaaaace
2024-08-18 11:47:47 +0000 UTCI personally love it, and support Decanter's ideas for NSFW, animations, it would certainly make me pay more attention to combat, rather then the old, am I picking the correct group/skill, attack for this enemy? But if it's feasible, or can be make feasible, then I'm all for it, do what you can, and try not to stress to much about it, Annikath already weighed in on this thread, so talk with them, and see how best to get it accomplished.
Darthjake
2024-08-18 11:15:28 +0000 UTCI think it would be a good idea to do what you can to spice up the combat on a visual level. TLS has the best plot of any rpgm game but other games like Karryn's Prison have moved the post for what can be done with the combat engine.
Nathan Phoenix
2024-08-18 05:30:37 +0000 UTCTLDR: I say add it to the "Do eventually" list and focus on important set piece art. Since its going to be a toggleable option, there is going to be a set amount of players that may never see all the bust depending on how early they turn it off. Or, just like default combat effects, they might eventually get stale on turned off by users after a untold amount of hours. For example, while I can't speak for anyone else I have 186 hours total (3 runs) in the game and I can safely say that 3/4 of that time is with effects off. Some may counter with the fact that the bust are less "boring" than the combat effects, but if you see the same set of Busts for 100+ hours, anyone may get fatigated of them. Also, as a player I would prefer the art for major set pieces be finished before theses bust. As I believe it would make the game feel more "complete" and polished than having combat busts. I still remember the first scene without any art was kind of jarring even with the warning right before it happened. In fact, I could say it soured the scene a bit. It took away from the story and effected that play session a bit. While combat bust might help players connect with the characters more, I think the story as it is right now does a wonder job of doing so and the Bust would be a cherry on top. Lastly, I still think having the combat busts later down the line would be nice. As I personally love the idea of everyone having combat busts, as it it gives off a ton of character personality and identity for each combatant and make combat a little more pleasing to the eyes. Especially with the wide variety of characters that we gain access to later I think it be pretty cool to see them! As it was mentioned in the post with Aka's Transformation, it would also be a cool story telling method that would be hard to miss. As a example, I would love to see Simon's combat bust change over time as he gets used to his new powers and abilities, or other similar ideas. I still remember how much Simon kind of sucked in the beginning, and I loved how much of a power house he turned into after accepting his new powers. Think it'd be a cool moment to have his combat demeanor change with his cool black cloak later ^.^ Sorry for the long winded wall of text, and thanks for this amazing gem of a game!!!!
Martin caballero
2024-08-18 04:40:07 +0000 UTCNot having decided which skills will have which base images, I'm not sure exactly how this progression would feel. The new skills added next build are meant to make progression more consistent, but wouldn't necessarily all have new images. We do have some additions mid-game, such as synergy skills having special combinations. You may be using it as shorthand, but none of these are animations, for the record.
Sierra Lee
2024-08-18 03:51:24 +0000 UTCI don't think that TLS necessarily needs this but I do think that it is an awesome change that helps TLS stand out from other RPGM games. TLS does still look like an RPGM game. I do think that custom art helps in this case. I do think that the custom art allows you to show off character personalities significantly more than than the busts. I do think that is a reason to do more than like: - Basic attack - Guard - Skill - Item But I don't think you need to go crazy. Even just like three variations for skills would be enough. I'm not sure how much time and money you should spend on it, but I think you will get a good return on the investment here. Combat is a large part of the game even for those who enjoy other aspects of TLS more. I thought I might have more to say but it turns out that is it for now. I'll definitely look forward to whatever you decide.
Grim8P
2024-08-18 03:08:04 +0000 UTCThe battle art feels like a great way to show off more personality for the characters and make TLS stand out. I'm all in favor of a few variations for basic actions.
Ash
2024-08-18 02:55:08 +0000 UTCGiven that, then I think I'd really enjoy the dynamic busts since it would make the game feel more unique in its more generic engine.
Alistair
2024-08-18 02:20:50 +0000 UTCI'm torn, because on the one hand, I really like the art, and conceptually I think it's a really fun idea, but on the other hand, I suspect it'd be really hard to handle in a way that would be cost-efficient as a way of drawing players to the game. TLS is such a long game, with so many characters who're staples of the party for such a long time, that introducing the full set of character animations early on would mean a huge amount of combat progression over the course of the game with very front-loaded visual novelty. Introducing a bunch of character animations over the course of the game would be a fun way to reinforce the player's investment in the growing strength of their team, but that would get *really* expensive over the course of the game. Basically, a really thorough implementation is something I'd love to see, but hate to see you pay for.
Desertopa
2024-08-18 02:02:52 +0000 UTCPersonally I pretty much never have battle effects on, so the busts don't matter too much to me - on a marketability level though, I think they add a level of flair that could visually separate the game's battles from other RPG Maker titles. Plus it seems like an efficient use of resources given how much time you're in combat, and ties effects and spell names more effectively to the person casting them.
Besrodio
2024-08-18 01:49:11 +0000 UTCI think the more you can do to add to the art side of the game, the better, and I suspect most people would probably agree. The only major exception are perhaps those who either don't care about art at all or those who aren't particular fans of Annikath's art style. Not doing any of this is certainly not a dealbreaker for me (I have been playing since before the sex scene art was added) but I definitely would at minimum see it as a mild positive. More generally, it might expand the appeal of the game to people who might have passed the game by based on the limited amount of custom art. My only concern with this sort of thing for an arbitrary game would be if making these changes substantively detracted from the game or development time, but I don't see that particularly concern as significant problem for TLS specifically.
Drifted
2024-08-18 00:36:30 +0000 UTCWhile things that make TLS stand out visually are generally welcome, I think this is one that, for me at least, is going to be a very small benefit. The very first time that bust art blocks a stat, or makes it harder to see an enemy in the bottom-left corner, it will get turned off and stay off forever. I don't think it will add too much to immersion simply because the variety of attacks and weapons and foes will mean that it is *always* going to be an approximation much of the time ("If she is attacking a 1-foot tall spider, why is she looking up?", etc). So it's not a bad thing and will make a few people happy (and, more importantly, allow for nice screenshots to sell the game with) I don't think it's something you should spend much money on.
Dubsington
2024-08-18 00:36:02 +0000 UTCIt was what I had in mind, yes, given my understanding of the situation
Mycroft
2024-08-17 22:44:24 +0000 UTCI personally don't play TLS for the combat at all, but new art does look nice.
Wrath
2024-08-17 22:28:32 +0000 UTCThose combat bust poses just ooze quality! More unique art for every combat character has amazing potential, letting player see more of their outfit and the expressive personality. Yarra's five different expressions look great and that's probably the number You should try to go for. Different weapons/outfits variations are not needed, outside of permanent stuff.
Escarche
2024-08-17 22:18:35 +0000 UTCWhile I am very attached to Yarra's kissy face, I'm not opposed to this sort of thing. However, it would require us to complicate the battle busts scripts a bit in order to have both that and alternates for players who have flipped the "no nudity" option.
Sierra Lee
2024-08-17 22:16:43 +0000 UTCHaha, of course you're allowed. ^-^
Sierra Lee
2024-08-17 22:11:29 +0000 UTCOne thing I didn't mention in the post is that Rachnera's script already covers synergy skills, and they will indeed include the supporting character behind them!
Sierra Lee
2024-08-17 22:08:46 +0000 UTCI think the unique art option is a great idea! To keep the work required in check, maybe each character could just have three separate pieces of art: one for basic attacks, one for basic support actions, and a third, larger piece for MP-intensive, high impact moves like Incubus King's Emissary. Having ultimate attacks take up more space onscreen could really go a long way towards selling their power, I feel.
smurf
2024-08-17 22:03:06 +0000 UTCMy main thought is that if you're going to invest in this, then you should take the opportunity to sex it up more where appropriate. Have Yarra's tease bare a boob instead of being a PG-rated kissy face, hand *in* the skirt when using Masturbate, that kinda thing.
Decanter
2024-08-17 21:57:18 +0000 UTCI agree, I meant more that it will feel longer since they will be the same pictures over and over. Thinking of more of the combat bust ideas I am more excited about the idea. Especially looking forward to synergy skills if they will be done as there could be a lot of cool ideas there!
Sin Gin
2024-08-17 21:46:37 +0000 UTCAm I allowed to give my opinion, as an involved party? 😅 if so, I am in favor of doing the dynamic busts! I agree with the people who have said it makes combat easier to follow and it adds tons of charm to the battle system :> I would also like to point out that drawing the dynamic busts is much faster work than illustrating the sex scenes. Especially if we prioritize the amount, as others have suggested, we could get all of them done "relatively" quickly without adding too much of a delay to the regular art schedule, I think. Lastly, I am against the addittion of the basic portrait busts instead, I don't feel like they convey the action any more than the faces on screen already do and I would find them redundant in that regard, even if they varied in expressions. Also, thank you Sierra, for showing off this new feature design in such a cool format, this is so fun! 😄✨️
Annikath
2024-08-17 21:23:31 +0000 UTCI would certainly prefer the battle art be prioritized, at the very least having one for attacking would be really cool! But I don't really care much about having art in the scenes much anyways, so I'm probably a bit of an outlier
Pikaton659
2024-08-17 21:20:50 +0000 UTCI think one offensive and one supportive pose per character would suffice, maybe during synergy skills the one performing the skill could use the offensive while the one whom they synergize with appear behind them in the supportive pose.
Lutvik
2024-08-17 21:18:17 +0000 UTCI think the impact of custom battle art/nonstandard rpgm stuff can't be understated considering the frequency of battle in TLS. While sex scenes are required because of the genre of nsfw games, battle art that is more interesting is going above and beyond standard rpgm fare in a place you see extremely often.
Dmitry F
2024-08-17 20:57:55 +0000 UTCHonestly would love to see more dynamic animations in combat. I think the busts are a good compromise though, but honestly I'm down for either, although obviously better stuff is better. I'm also okay with it remaining as is though, since I personally don't play an awful lot of RPG maker games and the combat system has yet to lose its charm for me. But... I would certainly not be complaining if I got to watch Yarra use her charms instead of just imagining it!
Jai Valentine Wilhems
2024-08-17 20:38:57 +0000 UTCThe Chosen will definitely get full images, for the sake of first impressions, and I think it makes sense for temporary members to get at least one image so the overall style is consistent.
Sierra Lee
2024-08-17 20:36:40 +0000 UTCDon't worry, we are on the same page: I intend to have all QoL features 100% finished before I do the version 1.0.0 release.
Sierra Lee
2024-08-17 20:34:56 +0000 UTCIt reminds me of burst animations in Nikke: Goddess of Victory. Go for it.
Runcible Technician
2024-08-17 20:34:44 +0000 UTCThat's a fair opinion, but for the record the battle busts don't slow down combat at all, they just display during the other events.
Sierra Lee
2024-08-17 20:33:40 +0000 UTCWe actually do a similar gag with Simon getting small NPC dialogue in the prologue before graduating to full busts later!
Sierra Lee
2024-08-17 20:32:37 +0000 UTCThis is truly epic honestly! It adds a lot to the dynamic and especially having several different ones for different skills is honestly incredible. That is indeed a lot of art to draw though... But Imho definitely worth it!
Jeno
2024-08-17 20:19:57 +0000 UTCLimit the new art to just 2 new poses. You don’t need too many new poses. Being economical about it, default pose can be used for generic actions with changed expressions, then a more dynamic action pose then reuse the same pose with some added effects for special attacks. Stuff like that. Like Simon can have a pose where he does more combat stuff and a pose where he does more magic stuff. Limited animation is an art form in itself so I guess just try to research some other games that do a good job before making a decision.
KFSigurd
2024-08-17 20:12:05 +0000 UTCAgree with some others that a small number of dynamic combat busts would do a lot to improve the feel of combat, and given how much time you spend in combat this would significantly improve the overall feel and character's personalities.
Vitreous Humour
2024-08-17 19:48:03 +0000 UTCI personally don't care one way or the other. I'd leave the setting on whatever the default value is. I guess it adds a bit to the immersion and is a differentiator from the other RPGM games out there; but idk whether it makes sense to invest in from a financial perspective. It sounds like it's going to be expensive.
SantaTheHutt
2024-08-17 19:45:09 +0000 UTCDynamic art sounds like pretty great way to give the characters more personality, even if it was just one piece for attack, one of defend, spells, and item use. If you were to go this route I think giving at least a few of these art pieces for some of the temporary party members like, Sho, the orcs, the chosen at the beginning of the game, Antarion, would be a great way to give more personality to/make jokes at the expense of some of those characters
An_Insane_Rogue_AI
2024-08-17 19:33:14 +0000 UTCFor my two cents, I will echo others in support of the dynamic busts! I think adding them would also help to ease your fears of new players thinking this is just another rpg maker game or something, by going that extra mile for the presentation! And personally if it came down to it /in terms of priorities, I would rather have the unique busts done first! Especially since in my opinion you do such an excellent job describing the scenes already that the actual in game art is more of a nice bonus if that makes sense? Whereas the busts would help visualize something new! ^~^
Argo The Ratfolk
2024-08-17 19:09:04 +0000 UTCAAAAAA LET'S GOOOO I think the dynamic art is a fabulous idea! If I had to choose, I would pick the dynamic busts over new scenes, purely on a personal perspective. Thankfully your work definitely does not suffer from a lack of characterization, but it can never have too much hehe. And speaking as someone who is not really fond of RPGM battle system, having more flavor to it makes it more palatable imo. If I can give my two cents on the business side, I think that even if this is decided to be implemented later, it shouldn't be after 1.0, but before. I think it's reasonable to assume this will be the moment with most public exposure, and with the battle looking like this, I know it would catch lots of attention. Also, assuming this dynamic bust does get picked, I would obviously like lots of expressions, but I'd advocate that it can start somewhat limited. For example, 2 actions/expressions per character, as a baseline for the system (such as for 1.0 release), and then more are added at the best pace you guys feel comfortable at (post 1.0 or whenever).
Decarabia
2024-08-17 19:00:18 +0000 UTCAs far as I am concerned, 2 or 3 different combat busts per character already would add a lot of charm. Maybe that wouldn't let the combinatorics side get out of hand? But then I'm *sure* some people would complain about lack of variety if that was the case
R
2024-08-17 18:59:14 +0000 UTCOn one hand, I think dynamic busts are really interesting and cool addition to the game. On the other, given that the busts would stay on screen as long as the animations would I feel conflicted. Speaking from personal experience on repeat playthroughs and even just attempts at a challenging fight, the animations slowly begin to drag when I just want to kill the enemy. I fear that the busts would end up in a similar situation where they go to waste just for the sake of speed. I just don't want the work you and Annikath put in to be wasted.
Alistair
2024-08-17 18:57:18 +0000 UTCFor me, the time you spend in combat makes this a non-brainer. Yes more art is needed for some scenes, but how long are those scenes compared to these combat busts you will see through the entire game? For me these will elevate the game.
Naillesy
2024-08-17 18:49:08 +0000 UTCThat is an awesome idea, but I haven't played through more than maybe the first third of the game and most of the sex scenes I saw had art, so I might be underestimating the impact on the later game where few scenes have art (to my understanding). The art does enhance the sex scenes, but I'm aware of few RPG makes games that do interesting stuff with the combat animations, so I think it's definitely a standout change.
Atashkada
2024-08-17 18:35:17 +0000 UTCWhile the player's subjective experience may vary, for the record I don't think adding the combat busts (either type) actually slows down combat at all. The images are just shown for the time something else would be on screen anyway.
Sierra Lee
2024-08-17 18:30:11 +0000 UTCIn step 2, do you mean wait for ALL the sex scenes to be finished? Yes, there's nothing stopping us from doing the art in any order we want, the question is impact.
Sierra Lee
2024-08-17 18:26:54 +0000 UTCI think the dynamic busts are a really fun idea! On a personal priority level, I'm a bit hesitant to advocate for prioritizing it over the current log of scenes needing illustration. However, this would also inject some fresh life into the early game (and pair well with the combat adjustments you are working on). I think it could also present a great opportunity to make the prologue gag even funnier by further contrasting Simon and Kai (maybe even disabling Simon's battle busts in the prologue like the pleb npc he is). I think it could really make the game stand apart (more than it already does) right off the back, helping get new players hooked. Since all the early game scenes have already been illustrated, keeping the current illustration schedule is more of a treat to already deeply invested players. But Annikath is also one person doing an immense amount of art. So I'd say if there were any worries about not being able to finish illustrating the game, I'd leave well enough alone and stick to the current illustration goals. But if you are confident that the whole project will get done and it is just a question of whether it's worth delaying Chapter 4 and 5 scene art for the sake of this new system, I do think it would be worth investing time and resources into the fully illustrated dynamic busts. They will be seen early and often throughout the game. But I do agree that it would be best to avoid combinatorial explosion trying to account for damage taken, special weapons or armor, or whatever other continuity details people can think of. Basically I think just Aka's transformation, Simon's pallet swap, and (maybe) Robin's transformation for the few fights that appears in would cover it. But those are just my thoughts, hope the help.
Jeffrey Lebowski
2024-08-17 18:25:53 +0000 UTCI don't know if it makes sense to invest a ton into SFW scenes, but at some point we could do an entirely SFW set of art and ask players what they most want to see illustrated.
Sierra Lee
2024-08-17 18:24:07 +0000 UTCI really like the dynamic combat busts, as you said, people would be seeing them a lot.
Aria the bunny
2024-08-17 18:22:45 +0000 UTCThank you very much! You guys have given me a career, so it's truly a pleasure to put effort into my work. ^-^
Sierra Lee
2024-08-17 18:19:01 +0000 UTCI want all sex scenes and a few SFW scenes illustrated eventually- those will do more for the game and be seen by more fans imo. But this battle animation stuff is cool also. Good stuff.
AchtungNight
2024-08-17 18:10:20 +0000 UTCI think that while the different poses look like they could be great and would certainly add character and flavor to each members’ combat niche, they may take away from some big fights like the incubus king fight making the battle seem longer and more silly. Additionally the game is quite long so the appeal may diminish 100 hours in. There is also the interesting idea of showing the progression with nalili’s sexual appeal to cleavage and Simon’s combined strike. I may be making an assumption, but I think most people play without battle animations since there are a couple of timed sections and the animations add a large amount of time to the game. So there is the possibility of the effort being under-appreciated. Overall, I think this idea has good potential in combining gameplay with character, but I am unsure if it will be worth doing. Definitely will be happy whichever way you end up choosing.
Sin Gin
2024-08-17 18:01:34 +0000 UTCVhala's Unperson Aura should have her looking all menacing with chibi succubi fleeing in terror.
Captain Hair
2024-08-17 17:58:41 +0000 UTCI myself would prefer the more dynamic combat art as a way to spice up TLS's combat a bit more versus art for single scenes way down the road into the game. In a way I feel this is more "bang for your buck" given that we'd see these combat "animations" in every fight versus getting art for a single scene. And I say this as someone who really likes the scene art. At the very least, I'd like to see the basic bust "animations" in combat to help convey who is currently attacking.
Dragunov404
2024-08-17 17:55:18 +0000 UTCI definitely love the idea of dynamic combat busts but agree with others when they say it shouldn't take away from other more important issues that you want to focus on. I'd say it can be something that can wait until a post 1.0 release.
Jacob
2024-08-17 17:54:45 +0000 UTCI also really like the more dynamic combat busts. But the question is also : does this need to be done asap ? To my understanding, you could step 1 : use non dynamic bust like in picture 2 step 2 : wait for the scene to be finished step 3 : use dynamic bust like in picture 3 or do I miss something ? Also, thank a lot for the dedication you put into this game.
Mycroft
2024-08-17 17:47:41 +0000 UTCThough I've previously said "more art" that is a lot more art, though it looked good. I think I also go with "busts". Maybe post 1.0 development slowly adding actions?
Erdson
2024-08-17 17:46:12 +0000 UTCGod damn that looks amazing!! Now in line with the other more sensible comments, if you do it, just make sure it does not rob time of other more important tasks.
Huevo Podrido
2024-08-17 17:44:12 +0000 UTCI like the idea of the custom art, but given that Annikath's bandwidth is limited, if given the choice, I'd probably prefer that time to be spent on more art for major non-sex events (along the lines of Janine's wedding, Orcent and Simon's bar conversations, etc). I agree with your point about the combat visuals being highly visible, though, so it's perhaps a better call for marketing as opposed to preaching to the converted.
Lamsey
2024-08-17 17:38:01 +0000 UTCI really love the more dynamic combat busts on a personal level. And as a more pragmatic thought, it'll make tracking who's doing what in combat a lot easier--it can be easy to lose track in a long fight, when your eyes kind of glaze over. Having quick-glance information as actions are performed would be quite nice.
PingZing
2024-08-17 17:37:20 +0000 UTCNeither options are particularly game-changing for me but I’d definitely go for more dynamic poses than the busts in exchange for delays in art for sex scenes. I also feel this would be more eye-catching for newcomers than sex scenes four chapters down the line? Depends on their priorities I guess.
Hansworth
2024-08-17 17:22:48 +0000 UTCIf triple a studios put 1/18th of an effort into their games as you, I'd be a happy man. Unrelated, but TLS has been THE standard I've set for myself for adult games for years, so thanks for all the work you've put into it.
Victor Gealtach
2024-08-17 17:07:14 +0000 UTC
