SakeTami
WhiskyTangoFox
WhiskyTangoFox

patreon


DevBlog - Energy Weapons

So, I've had a week off on family vacation, which means a week away from my pc, so no update on the prerelease. I am still looking for feedback on how the direct hit and bastion change feels. It's not a certainty that it's coming to the full list, very much still an experiment at this stage.


In between chasing a toddler around a pool trying to apply more sunscreen so she doesn't fry like the cutest slice of bacon ever, I've been thinking about the distribution of energy weapons and ammo. Yeah, I know, I may have a problem disconnecting. Anyway. Ballistic weapons have a really good distribution on LitR, with Arsenal giving weapons a bit more of a defined niche. Pistol, manual and auto all have their own ammo progression. But energy weapons are still the lazy, one-size-fits-all solution from vanilla. I've been thinking through options to fix that...


Laser weapons are relatively simple, just bring back Energy Cells for laser pistols, leave fusion cells for manual laser rifles (plus a small tweak to vanilla lasers to reduce the firing rate a little), and make Automatics use Electron charge packs. There's already an excellent mod for a laser pistol, and it's pretty easy to disable pistol grips on the vanilla laser and slow down it's fire rate, as well as make the institute version fully automatic , or I could just add a caliber swap on the automatic barrel. 


The problem, is plasma weapons.


Vanilla plasma has the same universal platform as lasers, however there isn't a precedent from older games for splitting plasma cartridges into 3 new ammo types (pistol plasma, rifle plasma, auto plasma). I'm also not convinced adding an additional two variant ammo types brings that much to the game here. In previous fallout games plasma weapons were effectively variant users of laser ammo. I cound do that here, and just remove plasma cartridges completely, however that does leave us with plasma weapons with reload animations featuring a non existent ammo type. Not the end of the world, but confusing for players who aren't aware of the change.


So what do people think. Does plasma ammo variants for pistol, rifle, and auto make sense? Or does more ammo types than we already have sound excessively complicated? Does the reload animation not matching the ammo type bother you as much as it does me?

Comments

Effectively yes, the idea I'm working with is that all Synth weapons are full auto

WhiskyTangoFox

Do you plan to increase institute weapon attack speed or keep as is? Just curious how dangerous synthetic fights will get. Not that I'm against them being even more dangerous. They are just rare enough that being a real challenge is nice.

Dangitman102490

For now, don't worry about it. By the time you're back from holiday I should have enough of the system worked out for a pre-release, and have a more specific idea of where teh holes are that need filling.

WhiskyTangoFox

So there is a mod with modder resources exactly for this https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/70572 What I can do is to replace Plasma Cartridges ammo model in Meshes/Ammo/Plasma/PlasmaCellMagazine.nif to either of two Energy Cells from this recourse (bottom-right and far-right ones) https://staticdelivery.nexusmods.com/mods/1151/images/70572/70572-1681677280-151314178.jpeg Thus it will replace the model for the world object and inventory interfaces everywhere. Then will need to rename all Plasma Cartridge in F04Edit into Energy Cell and just tweak spawns and LL. And will either replace or create a new Magazine model for the Zap Gun with the chosen Energy Cell attachment in place of Fusion Cell. Would that do?

Dead Grem

Just to clarify, what's your idea with Zap Gun? I do see that on Nexus page it has two possible magazine options, do you want another one or to swap Fusion Cell one to Energy Cell? https://staticdelivery.nexusmods.com/mods/1151/images/53998/53998-1629718246-969047818.png I haven't found Energy Cell model in Fallout 4 - Meshes / Ammo so is it from a mod as well?

Dead Grem

No rush. This whole energy weapon rework a fairly deep overhaul, that I'm not expecting to turn out overnight, i'm just kind of curious if it's possible.

WhiskyTangoFox

I'm going off tomorrow till August 26, if I'll have a chance try to have a look today.

Dead Grem

Any chance you'd be able to do something similar for Energy Cells and the Zap Gun? It's probably a little more complex, the zap gun has the fusion cell/core model on the magazine, and I'm not sure how it interacts with animations, but having an energy cell version of it would definitely be interesting.

WhiskyTangoFox

Yeah, I'm going with Institute for automatic, and non-institute for slower firing, both for laser and plasma. It works out pretty nicely, and there are the weapon mods available to support it fairly well. Shotguns I don't currently plan on splitting out, for energy weapons they're a muzzle or barrel attachment on the base weapon. I could disable it easily enough, but there just aren't really the weapon mods to replace it.

WhiskyTangoFox

After playing around with it, I think Ammo Health is definitely the way to go. It gives me another dimension to play with, that doesn't require adding more ammo types.

WhiskyTangoFox

well, this works quite nicely

WhiskyTangoFox

Lost train of thought, but adding that we don't have much plasma Weaponry. In my 250+ hour playthrough I only really saw a few in shops.

Dangitman102490

Didn't read all the comments as I got here late, but would it be possible if you devoted laser weapons to fast firing auto weapons and plasma into the more manual slow firing. As lasers should be faster than a charged plasma shot. Let's you keep ammo as it is and then you can focus more on replacers to broaden the laser and plasma leveled lists. Cause right now we have a few laser variants *could even have some unique lasers that have a gimmick and are slow firing, like the muskets and other guns that use more than 1 ammo per shot. Maybe even allow (of they are a thing on the nexus) laser/plasma shotguns. Then you got pistol, rifle, shotgun, and heavy weapons.

Dangitman102490

Fair point. But you still have to deal with world/container/vendor ammo swap in case of getting rid of Plasma Cartridges?

Dead Grem

The Fusion Cell is a bit shorter than a Plasma Cartridge, but it's only visible in crafting (see screenshots in Google Drive folder), when holding a weapon even the reload animation looks OK (see video). It might need a bit of adjustment, but it will surely alleviate the inconsistency. Also funny that I named the mod the same way as an existing mod on Nexus that just changes the ammo type. :D

Dead Grem

I'll check it out when I'm back home next week

WhiskyTangoFox

It's an interesting idea, but the lack of UI support is a deal breaker I think. I also don't want to have to redo ammo rarity to deal with it.

WhiskyTangoFox

So you can grab the mod here: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1wWqBKYgDLbtUGcLNhoYF-uEymTlb-pOf?usp=sharing It is a simple model swap with loose files and simple ammo type override with FO4Edit. I change ammo models for both vanilla plasma weapon and for the unique P94

Dead Grem

Well, that's interesting.

WhiskyTangoFox

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vYkhsVUVFk

Dead Grem

I almost did that, probably will finish up today =) Will need help converting changes and loose files into a mod though. And if you have added any custom or unique weapons into LitR that use plasma cartridge?

Dead Grem

Since it's a discussion may I suggest you to have a look at the mod? https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/21851 There is a discussion in the comments on the plasma cartridges as well. With that mod you can adjust the amount of drain to the (micro)fusion cells different for the laser and plasma and uniques, IMO it's a plus. And I have just checked animations in game for plasma and agree with Lokii that it doesn't seem to bother much

Dead Grem

The reload really doesn't bother me. Like that's the least concerning thing when it comes to balance tbh and i don't think anyone's ever complained about the ballistic side of things when loading a gun that clearly doesn't take that caliber. I've been playing a lot of Capital Punishment and i think making Plasma and laser using the same ammo type should be the go to option. There's also argument here that Plasma is double the damage of Laser in terms of damage in fallout 4 (just going off wiki for damage here, not any other mods). With the only drawback between the two being plasma velocity speed. Don't know if it would be worth looking into make Plasma consume double the ammo or changing the damage ratio, but it's a fine line between making plasma and laser the same damage, as laser will just be better overall provided we care about velocity speed. There are some really broken plasma sprayers as well to look into if we're making a universal ammo type for Energy pistol/Rifle/etc

Lokii

Maybe by someone with more. Modeling experience. It's not the kind of thing I've ever gotten into

WhiskyTangoFox

Would it be possible to swap the model of the reload animation? It will be clipping through, but will show the correct ammo type at least =)

Dead Grem


More Creators